D&D The Ultimate Gateway System

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Episode Transcript

Mark:
[0:00] Welcome to RPG Blokes, the podcast where we guide middle-aged newcomers as they

Mark:
[0:04] take their first brave steps into the world of tabletop role-playing games. So whether you’re curious, cautious, or completely new to the concept, we’ve got you covered.

Mark:
[0:13] This week, we’re diving into what we consider to be the ultimate gateway RPG, Dungeons & Dragons, and in particular 5th edition. But we’re going to talk more generally about the phenomenon that is Dungeons & Dragons. It’s a game that has introduced millions to the hobby And if you’re tuning in here, chances are it’s the game you’re eager to try, So we’ll explore why D&D is such a great starting point for new players What makes it so enjoyable and why it’s been such a positive force for the hobby as a whole, Introducing the RPG blokes. Stephen is the only one amongst us who has played every edition of D&D from the early 80s until this very day. He has never been found more than 10 metres from a player’s handbook.

Stephen:
[1:12] True fact.

Mark:
[1:14] Yes, yeah.

Stephen:
[1:14] Your Wikipedia, that.

Mark:
[1:16] John started playing D&D before all of us. Impressive. Although now I think of it, considering his age, he started doing everything before all of us.

Jon:
[1:26] Holds but fair.

Mark:
[1:29] Barry, a self-proclaimed rules lawyer, now with an impressive five years full-time experience playing D&D, but zero hours as a DM, and obviously worried about what he’s got coming to him.

Barry:
[1:40] I worry about nothing.

Mark:
[1:44] I’ve got ahead of myself a bit here, and I’ve come up with 20 reasons why D&D is great. And I just want to run through them with you blokes and get your take on them. They’re pretty much covers everything we need. If I’ve missed anything, you can obviously say, and it’ll come up, I’d imagine, as we’re talking about them in turn. Number one, the rich heritage.

Stephen:
[2:05] It is the OG, as the kids would say. I think that means original. It’s one that everyone else is based on, really. It’s the original role-playing game. so everyone has taken a leaf out of their book and created their own but yeah i mean 50 years i believe that so you can’t argue with that sort of history i mean that is a lot of play testing that.

Mark:
[2:23] As a new player coming into it as a middle-aged uh bloke barry you you pick up on that you sense that about it.

Barry:
[2:30] So um like immediately one of the things that i noticed about dungeons dragons as a completely new player was you know it’s polished you know the resources are beautiful The books are gorgeous. Everyone who’s sat around a table and rolled some dice has at least some kind of knowledge of it working and how it works as a system. You know, I wasn’t aware of its history. It was obvious that it was established and polished. When, you know, a DM would open their campaign book, you know, I did find myself quite often distracted by the cover. You know, oh, that’s pretty. In terms of the package, it’s all there.

Jon:
[3:04] For the rare few that had an interest in fantasy and stuff like way back, definitely a breath of fresh air. For all that we love, Tolkien, it’s very dry. Whereas D&D gave everyone an opportunity to express whatever they felt.

Mark:
[3:21] Tolkien was far closer to the hobby than it feels now.

Jon:
[3:25] It was direct.

Mark:
[3:26] It was direct, yeah.

Stephen:
[3:26] It was copyright for you.

Mark:
[3:28] Yeah, so moving on to point two, it’s a pop culture icon. So D&D has become synonymous with geek culture, referencing shows like Stranger Things, The Big Bang Theory, and so on. And so you’re going to encounter it and know about it. Pretty much everybody knows what D&D is. I mean, they might not understand exactly how it’s played. The public awareness of it is huge.

Barry:
[3:49] Stranger Things was a big deal. That was a really, really clever bit of marketing. You could play the kids from Stranger Things’ character. They did like a Stranger Things starter set. You didn’t play the kids. You played the character that the kids were playing in their campaign. They came as pre-gend.

Mark:
[4:07] I didn’t realise that was what it was. It was a really.

Barry:
[4:08] Really clever little. You know, Stranger Things was utterly brilliant. And remains so for me. It’s an absolute banger.

Stephen:
[4:15] Yeah. I mean, it’s positively portrayed in the media. Back in the 80s, I guess it was the opposite. They had programs that portrayed players as devil worshippers. But now when it’s in Stranger Things, I think, well, cool.

Mark:
[4:25] It’s quite a turnaround.

Stephen:
[4:26] It is a massive turnaround.

Barry:
[4:27] Can I just say I’ve been, you know, consistently disappointed by the lack of devil worship. I thought I was getting into some kind of debauched cult.

Jon:
[4:35] But it hasn’t been initiated yet. That’s all that is. Oh my God, I haven’t earned it.

Mark:
[4:39] But you never played when you were in your youth.

Barry:
[4:41] You know even even in my youth i was fairly cynical when i you know it was blindingly obvious to anyone with half a brain that this was not a cult and not devil worship and the way that the you know christian conservatives pounced upon it you know i kind of i respected it for pissing the christian conservatives off i’m like i’m you but i wouldn’t say obviously i didn’t play it when i was a kid so it didn’t attract me enough to play it but it certainly made me think i think it’s unlikely that that’s the work of the fucking devil.

Mark:
[5:14] It’s unlikely it’s done the game any harm either, has it? Putting it that way, it would have been more appealing to people to get involved with something that might be slightly forbidden.

Barry:
[5:22] Oh, no such thing as bad publicity, right?

Mark:
[5:25] And in a way, that had to be forced, didn’t it? That narrative did need to be forced for it to become such a pop culture icon now and be so clearly understood and accepted. And, you know, you buy these things for your children without any second thought.

Stephen:
[5:38] Yeah, and it has become very much mainstream. More than even it was in the heyday in the 80s. I think it’s become even more. I mean, it is like the second golden era of D&D.

Stephen:
[5:46] And I would say it’s bigger than the first.

Mark:
[5:48] I think so. We were recently at the MCM London Comic Con. Never seen so much Dungeons and Dragons at these events before.

Stephen:
[5:53] Well, video games as well has kind of pushed that forward. Baldur’s Gate 3 that you say I’m like the expert of.

Mark:
[5:59] Yeah. The next thing I’ve got here is blockbuster films. Okay. In our experience, not all D&D films have been blockbusters.

Stephen:
[6:06] Well, it’s been two, isn’t it?

Jon:
[6:07] At least four. Oh, okay.

Stephen:
[6:09] I didn’t have two. The Jeremy Irons 2001, wasn’t it?

Jon:
[6:12] Yeah, which was awful.

Stephen:
[6:12] Okay. I don’t know the other ones.

Jon:
[6:14] I can tell you.

Mark:
[6:16] Go on, John.

Jon:
[6:16] Okay. So you had that one, Blue Lipstick. Like, Amadal, was it? Appeared as some weird background NPC for the second one, which was much more a quest-based traditional D&D one. It was actually quite good, but low budget. Most of you have never heard of it.

Stephen:
[6:31] No, I’ve never heard of it.

Jon:
[6:32] The third one went off an interesting tangent. It was a good guy of a knightly order who infiltrated an evil party. The fun part about that movie was recognising the spells because they were accurate to the source material.

Mark:
[6:49] And.

Jon:
[6:49] And it was a really good story well worth a watch yeah.

Mark:
[6:53] Yeah the latest film right fantastic really really got it i mean for us as well we’re quite demanding we would want this to be quite accurate like you say in that respect want to see spell effects and things like that it was a real pleasant surprise how how good it was do you yeah.

Barry:
[7:07] I thoroughly enjoyed it it was i believe the expression is it was a romp you.

Mark:
[7:10] Know it had the.

Barry:
[7:11] Right amount of comedy in it and like you say um you you kind of recognize the spells although there was artistic license used.

Mark:
[7:16] If you hadn’t played it before perhaps this movie would be one of the reasons why you’re listening to us it’s great to see your hobby if you’re a veteran or you played it to be able to go and go to the movies and see something that connects with you just just that much you know you’ll have that experience in

Mark:
[7:30] the future you start playing now then the next dnd film comes out if.

Barry:
[7:34] You are a fan of any fantasy fiction genre you will recognize bits of it in dnd do you know what i mean it doesn’t have to be a dnd branded movie you know you you watch conan the barbarian you know yeah Yeah, that could be a campaign.

Mark:
[7:48] So that does move on to the fourth point, which is inspired countless stories. So it’s influenced other franchises. Like you say, you’re going to describe Conan. There’s others, right?

Jon:
[7:58] They sort of dropped the ball with Ready Player One. heavily influenced by D&D. Yeah. And they completely…

Stephen:
[8:05] Spielberg did it, didn’t they? I think he only got rights for certain things, didn’t they? They even put things about The Shining in, didn’t they? Yeah. To sort of like fill these gaps.

Barry:
[8:13] Yeah.

Stephen:
[8:13] So they got the rights to certain things that they owned maybe as a studio and then went with those.

Jon:
[8:16] Yeah, that’s a huge chunk.

Mark:
[8:18] We’ll move on to literature as well. So you’ve got tie-in novels.

Stephen:
[8:21] Yeah, I read them.

Mark:
[8:23] Seriously high-quality books as well.

Stephen:
[8:24] Yeah, but there are certain ones that have stayed the test of time and they would be the Dragonlance books by Waz and Hickman and the Dritz books by R. Ray Salvatore.

Mark:
[8:31] Now, the library must be huge. John, have you read a lot?

Jon:
[8:35] I mean, I read a lot of D&D stuff back then. The Moonshay trilogy, that was my particular favourite that really hit with me.

Stephen:
[8:45] Awesome.

Jon:
[8:46] The Icewind Dale stuff, that was nice. I’ve lost track of the Dredd stuff because I haven’t been reading D&D.

Mark:
[8:54] Yeah.

Stephen:
[8:55] It’s like 30 books he’s done on my own.

Jon:
[8:57] But I really enjoyed those when they started off. I liked the little quotes, little diary entries at the beginning of each chapter. They were particularly good. And I remember that more than I do the story.

Mark:
[9:12] But this is all there for you to read. And we find new players come in quite often and they sit at the table. And even the modern games in the modern version of Dungeons & Dragons, they are set in these worlds where the literature is already there. And you kind of suggest to them or they ask, what can I read? and you just say, well, read this. I mean, you know that you’re doing them a favor. There is, with Dungeons & Dragons, we’ve already pointed this out, a vast library of content. So decades of official material provide endless inspiration for campaigns. So we’ve got a system here which, you know, you can never, ever play everything that’s there. It’s just, that’s a bonus, right? Because you’ve got that depth of quality and material. You know that you can make a lot of choices once you’ve started playing it. You can start to dive deeper into the areas, even back into the old PDFs that are still available online to buy.

Mark:
[10:04] So it’s not something that many other systems can bring to the table.

Stephen:
[10:07] There’s a huge depth to D&D for sure, yeah. if you want to delve really back in the past that you can update to the new edition or fifth edition and a lot of the time they’ve done it themselves a lot of the old scenarios have been repurposed like the Curse of Strahd which we probably rate as one of the best as it originally was a first edition game then a second edition game they did a bit in third and now it’s a fifth edition game which they’ve put together so there’s plenty of back material and it’s been.

Mark:
[10:31] Brought together just so masterfully and John you’re somebody that likes to delve back into previous editions and into libraries for systems. D&D offers you that.

Jon:
[10:42] Yeah. I still like crossing over and stuff like that, but when you look at the older editions and a lot of it’s memory lane because we were actually there and you see how things have changed and progressed, sometimes they shouldn’t just re-skin everything and just slap a price tag on it. You want to change it, update it, actually make it worth the reinvestment of time and money when you get some of these things. Some of them are great. Some of them are just money sinks.

Mark:
[11:18] But of all systems that are able to bring things out of the back catalog and do exactly that, D&D and Wizards of the Coast have the resources to do it and get it right, as you just suggested with the Ravenloft, it is just that.

Jon:
[11:30] They’ve got the resources, yeah. Again, it’s a case-by-case basis.

Mark:
[11:35] So for instance I would say with Ravenloft the 5th edition version it does really in some ways just scratch the surface of what lies underneath oh yeah especially with 2nd edition the amount of material the Van Richten’s guides the additional monster compendiums the islands that were further detailed the 40 or 50 scenarios the individual modules there is a Van.

Stephen:
[11:54] Richten’s 5th edition supplement.

Mark:
[11:57] That really scratches the surface yeah it did because 2nd edition was huge it does so brilliantly well but if you want more it’s there so moving on to uh the eighth point is balance of simplicity and depth dnd offers offers simple rules for beginners with layered complexity for experienced players and barry i know this is a part of, the system that you appreciate and i.

Barry:
[12:23] Mean you don’t have to do a lot of sums you know it’s like you roll a dice and then you add three or four to it like it’s yeah it is pretty easy in terms of that stuff um i think the dm has to do a little bit more but yeah generally speaking it’s an easy rule set you know.

Mark:
[12:37] And and it’s very accessible but it’s also complex so stephen i just come to you here because you’ve often described dnd as a simple game and i think you know we’re not talking about any particular edition of it and we know that the latest edition is far more simple than the previous ones i would describe.

Stephen:
[12:55] As the least crunchy version of dnd that’s ever been um which makes it more simple to to play and i’m talking about simple in the way it flows really previous editions you’d add numbers to numbers to get bigger numbers and they’ve kind of stripped that all out and replaced it with more simpler mechanics but in which case it is a fairly lightweight rule system when you’re at the surface of it but you can potentially

Stephen:
[13:19] delve a little bit deeper underneath it.

Mark:
[13:20] Yeah exactly the point that it does that well so the ninth point is endless replayability as a modular system ensures every campaign feels unique even when revisiting similar themes so in a previous podcast two of us said that if they were left with only one system, desert island it would be dnd.

Stephen:
[13:39] Yeah i did pick it as my my one pick because of that really yeah it doesn’t try to specialize entirely in one area in.

Mark:
[13:45] Comparison to other systems.

Stephen:
[13:47] Really a lot of systems kind of focus very sharply on on one style of play or one type of scenario and dnd it doesn’t no it tries to be a bit of everything because.

Mark:
[13:57] We played dnd for 40 years right so that is.

Stephen:
[14:00] Endless.

Mark:
[14:00] Replayability barry you feel that way about it too i mean you.

Barry:
[14:03] Feel like even in the what five years i’ve been playing i’ve scratched the surface of like you know terms of races class character you know what i mean it’s like you know i’ve played a barbarian twice and i still feel like i’ve only scratched the surface of playing a barbarian yeah you know the amount that even once you’ve chosen a character class the amount of choice you have them within that there’s a lot to explore and enjoy i mean i think you can make an argument for lots of games being endlessly playable if you’ve got someone who’s you know prepared to um homebrew stuff constantly but in terms of you know endlessly playable

Barry:
[14:38] off the shelf i think dnd’s nailed it.

Mark:
[14:41] Some people only ever play dnd and that’s that’s the way they’ll always be engaged.

Barry:
[14:46] With the hobby and.

Mark:
[14:47] They’re not looking to do anything they’re perfectly.

Barry:
[14:49] Happy and that’s absolutely fine that’s absolutely fine you know it’s it’s you know i i like a little departure with another system every now and then but like i say quite often for me that’s just a little break yeah it’s just something different before i get back to a dnd campaign we.

Mark:
[15:01] Find that with most people that are coming into the hobby through our community that they want to play D&D. And even if they’ve already played it and you offer them something different, they’re unlikely to want to play anything else. And yeah, that’s fine. I wouldn’t criticize that at all.

Mark:
[15:15] It’s the power of D&D, something we’re all beholden to and we’re grateful for. So we’re bringing new people into our hobby.

Jon:
[15:21] There was a campaign I watched, I think it was third edition, and someone had re-skinned D&D with not many variables. They kept the system. and they was doing a Stargate campaign. uh really good okay you don’t have to redesign everything from scratch you just adapt feats and such like uh another one an official release was again third edition and it was judge dread.

Barry:
[15:51] Oh that’s a bit of me that is.

Jon:
[15:53] Yeah we have to.

Barry:
[15:54] Make that happen at the club i’m sorry yeah it’s just fucking not optional if.

Jon:
[15:57] That that doesn’t happen i will cry and throw up this is the open game license.

Stephen:
[16:01] If people are using so basically fifth edition dnd rules to make their own games up which.

Jon:
[16:06] Has been throughout.

Stephen:
[16:07] You know, since D&D began, people have been doing that from the third edition stuff. The D20 system, it used to be called, allowed anyone to make up games based on the D20 system, which is the D&D system.

Mark:
[16:18] And that still applies to the latest edition?

Stephen:
[16:21] Yeah, they tried to make it not apply, or caveat the rule. I don’t blame them too much, but the caveat, what could be used as an open game license and restrict it and what they can earn from it. But yeah, people are free to, currently I believe, to make up a game based on the 5th edition rules they were fantastic.

Jon:
[16:37] They brought out I think it was official a D20 system for Call of Cthulhu.

Stephen:
[16:42] Yeah it was good.

Jon:
[16:44] But you’ve got a lot of variables there that really have to be redefined.

Stephen:
[16:48] But it was written by Monty Cook did you ever play it was great actually Monty Cook’s brilliant when it comes down so he really loved Cthulhu was.

Mark:
[16:55] That Cthulhu modern.

Stephen:
[16:56] Yeah it was modern it was in the 1920s as well it’s.

Jon:
[16:59] A massive restructure to do.

Mark:
[17:01] Another system for that the Judge Dredd thing Just for the record, there is a Judge Dread RPG. Games Workshop released that a while ago. I’ve got the old box of it. But they’re re-releasing it now. The developers I spoke to at Dragon Meat last year. So by this year, I think they’ve probably got it all out.

Barry:
[17:17] You know, if you were just making a game for you and your mates, you can use any mechanics you like. You’re homebrewing. Pick your favourite mechanics. Yeah.

Mark:
[17:25] And D&D is lending itself to be that mechanic for all games.

Barry:
[17:29] I mean, I think it’s worth saying as well, When I’ve met people that said there is a system that they would never play, quite often that’s D&D.

Mark:
[17:37] Old-timers you’re talking about.

Barry:
[17:39] Old-timers. I’ve had people say to me, people are married to that system. There’s plenty better out there. I’ll never play it again. And it’s like fair play to you, brother. You know, I am playing it.

Mark:
[17:47] But they’ve gone through 30.

Barry:
[17:48] 35 years.

Mark:
[17:49] Maybe.

Barry:
[17:49] You know, I don’t know.

Jon:
[17:50] I don’t know. I found fourth edition to be a nightmare. That’s common with most systems I’ve found. But fourth ed was…

Mark:
[17:59] We’ve all got our favourite edition of D&D. And maybe we’ll ask that at the end just to say…

Barry:
[18:03] Some of us have got our only edition of D&D.

Mark:
[18:06] But yeah this is not really talking and breaking down the different different editions we’re just talking about the dnd in general and why we think it is the the best gateway system for you so number 10 the diverse character creation players can craft heroes tailored on their personalities, play styles and creativity so barry you’ve already touched on this you know the the variation is enough for you to think you know what i can still play a barbarian for the third time and i’m going to get something else out of.

Barry:
[18:33] This absolutely absolutely because obviously you know as your character develops you make certain choices in in what direction that characters go in and and i do think there’s enough of those to mean that you can play the same class over and over again and still end up with a completely different guy i mean don’t get me wrong some of your some of your skills and attributes are obviously going to carry over you know you’re going to have your rages you’re going to have if you’re a warlock you’re going to have your eldritch blast you know no one no one plays a warlock and doesn’t pick eldritch blast, i might do that now.

Mark:
[19:03] I’ve suggested it.

Barry:
[19:03] Um so yeah i do think there’s enough in there for you to keep going and keep going and keep going and actually like i said i only own the player’s handbook.

Mark:
[19:12] Yeah and look how much fun you’ve had out exactly you know exactly.

Jon:
[19:15] If there’s something that you don’t like it is fairly easy to make your own.

Mark:
[19:22] Yeah so you’re talking about looking at some uh what you call monster races and using those as player characters yeah you often find those.

Jon:
[19:29] First third edition that started that the gnome got bounced around as a adventurer to a monster to.

Mark:
[19:36] Come to the next point then i suppose iconic monsters because the dnd’s bestiary is is legendary if everybody kind of knows them you’ve got the basics but they’ve even created their own monsters now that become our household names trademarked.

Stephen:
[19:48] Beholders are beholders aren’t they you can have monsters with the round and eyeballs but you can’t call them beholders introducing my behinder but it’s uh yeah i mean they are iconic they know they’re iconic and people want to use them but they can’t.

Mark:
[19:59] Well i hope they don’t come too precious about this is the trade-off.

Barry:
[20:03] As well isn’t it because you know d&d’s huge and hasbro even huger um but they are doing a good job and i do understand that yeah like like they’re they’re in it for the money this is a business as long as it’s they’re not doing it in like a super draconian way.

Mark:
[20:20] That would be unpleasant they’re standing on the shoulders of giants right people like us um that played as children and invested our time and imagination into these monsters, in particular as we’re talking about monsters, and elevated them alongside the Medusa or the Hydra or things that really existed within mythology. And we give them equal billing. And that is something that they should be very privileged to have that in their ownership. Because it was created by people in the 70s, 80s that come up with these modules that become larger than life, really. And there’s a great responsibility with that, I think. And hopefully they don’t just callously and heartlessly monetize, because I think they belong to us. They do, I think, as old-time players. These things belong to us.

Jon:
[21:09] I think there’s a certain game designer or game company who tried to trademark orcs, fuck off that’s a tricky one far too widespread well i don’t know if we want to wasn’t it orcs with a k.

Mark:
[21:25] Though they’re orcs i mean.

Jon:
[21:26] It doesn’t matter they’re.

Mark:
[21:28] Just trying to grab these things for themselves where they belong to everybody and dnd is so old and so ingrained in in the in the hobby and in the culture but you know separating that and claiming ownership over it is is quite i think aggressive and hopefully they don’t overdo that.

Jon:
[21:44] But like you said if someone comes up with something and publishes it and puts physical time they’re paying people to do these they should get paid that that yeah absolutely but yeah stopping someone from doing something like the critical.

Stephen:
[22:00] Role people come up a new role-playing game they can’t have beholders and owlbears in it because of their.

Jon:
[22:04] Trademarks but they might want to there was the spin-off from warhammer and spyhander yeah and it was i mean it was good it was nice read it was very pretty and all that but just slightly changing stuff so it is uncomfortably familiar i didn’t like it it was.

Mark:
[22:21] Too derivative and it yeah i found that too.

Jon:
[22:23] The system.

Mark:
[22:24] You know would have been great it’s a pity that it wasn’t warhammer fourth edition and that was the system for.

Jon:
[22:29] Warhammer fourth edition but yeah yeah.

Mark:
[22:31] They didn’t they never met.

Barry:
[22:32] I don’t know if it’s unique but it’s kind of interesting isn’t it that i have a very strong sense of community from this hobby but as a business venture as someone who’s trying to make.

Jon:
[22:43] Money exploiting.

Barry:
[22:46] That sense of community is something that worries me a little bit. Like they could go too far for me where I might say, well, that’s it. I’m not playing that again because that’s just a fucking money grab. You know, that finding that balance for when you’re, when you’re providing a hobby for a community, but also trying to make a buck, there is always the risk that you’re just going to push it that little bit too far and the community will turn against you.

Mark:
[23:06] They did.

Barry:
[23:07] They did. I remember that.

Mark:
[23:08] They are doing so. Yeah. So if you’re listening, Hasbro Wizards of the Coast you know, We have feelings. Don’t do this to us.

Barry:
[23:18] And we are not above revenge.

Jon:
[23:22] The name for that is, I think, Pathfinder. He did it.

Stephen:
[23:27] He went there.

Mark:
[23:27] Is that the element? Fuck you.

Barry:
[23:30] So can someone explain that to me then?

Stephen:
[23:31] Well, it’s the open game license. People could make their own versions of the system. And Piezo did a game called Pathfinder, which was based on the third edition Dungeons & Dragons rule set, which ironically become more popular than Dungeons and Dragons, so they made a shed load of money out of it which kind of was inspired them I think to kind of try and clamp down it a little bit that PAs were making so much money out of their IP so 5th edition come along and they managed to wrestle back the control of it I guess that’s the long and short of it.

Mark:
[23:58] In brilliant fashion yeah because Pathfinder has gone by the wayside.

Stephen:
[24:03] What.

Mark:
[24:03] A spectacular success 5th edition D&D has been unbelievable unbelievably positive for the hobby because we get so many people coming in just simply because of that system that they’re not coming in blind they’re coming in wanting to do this and yeah.

Barry:
[24:18] No and i think you need to acknowledge and give credit for that as well it’s like you know if something’s bringing people into the hobby then by and large you’ve got to think it’s a good thing yeah you can talk about the nuances and you know business practices and blah blah but at the end of the day if it’s bringing people through the doors then yeah you’re doing a good job thank you yeah yeah don’t push your luck though no that’s right i think.

Mark:
[24:40] So yeah uh so moving on uh the combat system in dnd is fast-paced yet tactical it’s quite streamlined not many people complain about the dnd combat system.

Stephen:
[24:50] Yeah yeah i think it’s one of the most streamlined ones i’ve played other games that could you get real bogged down in combat with dice rolls and dice pools and stuff you got one dice and you add a number to it it’s really it’s Probably as simple as you can get. Combats can take a while, but…

Mark:
[25:05] That’s more to do with how many players are.

Stephen:
[25:06] In the table. Yeah, more to do with the player count. Yeah.

Mark:
[25:08] Barry, you’ve said you prefer a system with an opposed dice roll. D&D doesn’t have that, but…

Barry:
[25:14] Don’t get me wrong, I think the D&D combat system is absolutely brilliant. You know, the people that design these things know much better than I do. But yeah, it did occur to me that when I was playing Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay and the opposed roles were introduced to me, I was like,

Barry:
[25:29] Okay, so this has added a layer of complexity, but I think it’s also added something positive. So it’s like, I think you can streamline too much. I’m not saying that D&D has. I think D&D, the combat rules work really well. Once you’ve had a few combat encounters, you know what you’re doing. You’ve got it down. But it’s just finding that balance between, like, streamlined play and an element of realism i think i i i like the opposed role thing.

Mark:
[26:04] Yeah dnd doesn’t have that but then i i think you have to your hit points are a resource and you do you do take good care of them because of that and make some maybe choices that you know you can’t can’t just walk into something and think you know what i can dodge everything i’m just gonna i i like it it works and also because you’ve got the long rest and short rest dynamic which allows you to reset and start again and it makes sense because you’re losing your hit points sometimes against kind of all odds or unfairly it’s nice to know you know all i’ve got to do is survive i can get out of this now and then come back strong again tomorrow i think it’s just very streamlined it’s just quick and it’s just moving you forward there’s.

Jon:
[26:42] A reason it works where we play like I said, Warhammer and Call of Cthulhu, and you can get whopped, and that’s your character out in real game time for a week or more. I mean, Dragon Warrior is, again, another favourite system, but the healing as written, like one health point, I think, for the week. It is closer to real, but it doesn’t lend itself to adventuring. So I get why D&D does what it does.

Stephen:
[27:15] There are optional rules actually in the dmg that you can be more realistic yeah.

Barry:
[27:18] I’m cherry picking it’s a fantasy it’s not going to be realistic but it’s something that you see in films as well it’s like you know someone has the absolute crap kicked out of them yet somehow after a good night’s sleep they’re ready to go and fight again it’s.

Mark:
[27:31] A high fantasy or.

Jon:
[27:32] They’re just young.

Barry:
[27:32] But if you but if you’re trying to tell a story stuff like that makes absolute sense because otherwise the story gets crippled i don’t need it to be hyper realistic i mean i don’t want to start paying taxes and having a fucking job okay.

Mark:
[27:43] People have only ever played dnd probably don’t know um what they’re getting there this the modern type of role-playing game where you’re always strong you’re always youthful you’re always at your full potential and you don’t really want to be in times where you’re stuck in the doldrums this system doesn’t allow you to feel that way it kind of brings you back up to to full vitality and then the next challenge warhammer’s.

Jon:
[28:06] Crit tables where you can of a favourite character gradually whittled away, literally piece by piece over the weeks. You don’t want him to die. You’ve invested time and effort into that.

Mark:
[28:18] Spend a fucking fade point, damn it.

Jon:
[28:19] If you can. But sometimes it’s not enough. And you’ve got your one-armed adventurer and you love that.

Mark:
[28:30] So, Streamline Combat. And the next one is Clear Progression System. Leveling up feels rewarding with meaningful gains in power skills and abilities so it’s just really cleverly done you always look forward to it never gets boring and there’s enough variety in it that i never quite know what i’m going to get from my next level until i’m there with it so you know it’s it’s complex enough to keep me engaged on.

Stephen:
[28:51] Yeah i mean dnd has two methods doesn’t it advancement which is the accumulation of experience or just uh milestones that’s the one yeah yeah uh which can make it flow a lot easier than not yeah yeah.

Mark:
[29:00] The milestone um route to experience at certain points within the story you you will just be told you you’ve gone up a level so you’re not micromanaging your progression yeah milestones become pretty much what dnd is about now isn’t it.

Stephen:
[29:12] Yeah it is easier isn’t it even though you do go up levels quicker than in previous editions in fifth edition dnd but yeah milestones does make it easier and as a dm you get the pace of the scenario a bit easier than if people going up around about the same sort of time as each other because you do if you especially if you split the experience between different characters at different points then you get different characters going up at different times i do feel mine milestone is from.

Barry:
[29:33] A player’s point of view milestone feels much fairer especially if you’re a player like me that works shifts and misses the occasional session you know if you’re doing.

Stephen:
[29:41] Xp i’m.

Barry:
[29:42] Immediately a disadvantage because i’ve got a crapper job than you yeah.

Stephen:
[29:46] Yeah crappier.

Barry:
[29:47] Crapper crappier crappier job than you.

Stephen:
[29:50] That was a brave decision to do xp on that one and very strict on it if you don’t turn up you don’t get xp oh wow that’s old school i did do that very old school why did i do that because what i did was when.

Mark:
[29:59] Players weren’t there i just their characters disappeared there was.

Stephen:
[30:01] Some people still gain experience while they disappeared tried.

Mark:
[30:05] Narratively to make them disappear but when a combat round is what six seconds and you know they might be tying their shoelaces around the corner for 30 seconds that’s.

Stephen:
[30:12] It yeah.

Mark:
[30:14] Uh john what do you prefer uh because dnd gives you the options doesn’t it but it has become very much a milestone xp experience now for most people playing yeah.

Jon:
[30:23] I mean most of the stuff i run is uh xp so it is incremental rather than one big burst arguments for both it’s down to your personal preferences. If you’re doing a campaign, try it differently. Try the first couple of levels on individual XP awards. It’s a bit more work for the ref. There’s different ways of doing it. There can be no XP if you don’t turn up, but the character should get XP if they’re NPC’d and their abilities are being used. It helps the ref with Milestone. You can predict the power levels that the character’s going to be able to bring to bear yeah so old school dnd used to be you’ve killed the monster you.

Mark:
[31:07] Get the xp so.

Jon:
[31:08] Things have changed a.

Mark:
[31:09] Bit since then it has.

Jon:
[31:10] The most of the time that got converted to being shared amongst anyone that joined in but yeah there was a thing so they had uh different xp levels so a rogue would rock it up in levels but overall, The power level wasn’t there with that level increase. Whereas a wizard, strong wind, kills them first level. That’s it, you’re done. D4, trip on a leaf. But later on, they get, you know, wish.

Mark:
[31:40] It’s been honed over many generations of this game. And the progression system in modern D&D system is at its best.

Barry:
[31:47] Certainly nothing wrong with the way that D&D reconciles leveling up. It is very streamlined. It’s very simple. And you’re right, you do really look forward to it. i think our dm a few weeks ago forgot to kind of tell us that we’d leveled up and we got it on a message via discord and like i had a bit of a spring in my step for the rest of the day like in my normal life and that was a bit like i was like oh i was leveled up.

Mark:
[32:10] You know yeah oh that was a nice bit of news it’s a lovely feeling yeah so that works really well and you lose a bit of that when you’re doing incremental um advancement yeah.

Jon:
[32:20] I suppose it can be a grind yeah i was.

Mark:
[32:22] Gonna say um obviously.

Stephen:
[32:23] Games like warhammer when you’ve got um you get experience per session you sort of like then you can build your character i find that when i’m doing those sort of games everyone becomes very specialist in the scenario you’re doing right there so everyone picks the skills just to do what exactly what they’re doing for that very moment, everyone becomes an expert of this campaign right then.

Mark:
[32:39] So moving on to the next one this is one of my favorite things about dnd actually and if i i don’t really want to teach wizards of the coast how to monetize what they’ve got but at the moment in the current edition this is seriously under-emphasized the magic system. Not spells for the characters so much, but just, everything else you know the magic items in particular but the magic system is massive and magic in dnd allows for endless creativity and tactical depth but you’ve also got a huge amount of objects again iconic objects that exist within the dnd universe and when i say about the latest edition you’re not quite so you that excitement of going up a level that used to be quite similar to getting a magical item i mean it never that that that’s gone from the game a little And I think the system, because it’s empowered players so much, that it no longer encourages that kind of…

Stephen:
[33:32] I think maybe the general sort of response to getting the magic item is definitely not as exciting as what I used to get when I get magic items because you get a lot of your abilities now when you go up a level. You’ve got all these kind of superhero kind of abilities of halving damage, doubling your damage, doing extra D10s on top of your damage, and plus 10s here, plus 10s there. You used to get those through magic items, like getting your plus five sword or your kind of invisibility cloak.

Mark:
[33:54] They’re all still there.

Stephen:
[33:56] They’re there.

Mark:
[33:56] Endless potions, endless cloaks, rings, rods, starves. I love them.

Stephen:
[34:01] I do love them. But it’s kind of become less important now because they do replicate a lot what panels already have in the characters.

Mark:
[34:08] But let’s look at the spell book, for instance, and a lot of other systems, your spell list, your options are very limited because it’s quite, I think, intensive on game building and system building to kind of flesh out a large amount of spells and integrate them within the system in a balanced way. D&D. There’s, I’d say, hundreds in the introduction to this section, but you could argue thousands of spells if you look back throughout all of the previous editions.

Jon:
[34:33] More.

Mark:
[34:33] Yeah. And the magic system itself is absolutely unbeatable, I think, as a system. Even my favourite system, Warhammer, it’s always struggled with its magic system, I find most other systems do.

Jon:
[34:46] The writers for that are usually quoted as Brent Lennar, what’s the best thing about Warhammer, and they’ll say something, and usually it will be the world-building story. What’s the worst thing about the system? It’s always magic.

Mark:
[34:58] It is magic, and D&D just does it so incredibly well. But what would you say to the, shall we call it, the eldritch blast dilemma, which…

Barry:
[35:06] Pew pew pew pew that’s what i’ll say it’s.

Mark:
[35:10] Just a country right so it don’t matter.

Stephen:
[35:11] So it’s the one the one spell that you just migrate to and i suppose it’s you know maybe they regret that spell was the cause i wonder if they do it’s just given the warlocks just the eldritch blast it’s so good and so versatile they’re just a sport you use and nothing else maybe they will or maybe the next decision they need to remove eldritch blast and see all the world’s going what.

Barry:
[35:28] People who have a down or an eldritch blast to just aren’t warlocks well it’s it’s really good fun and the fact that you only get two spell slots i think they had to do something i think when you’re looking at and we’ve talked about you know the balance comes up quite a lot and i think they had to do something for the warlock to mitigate the fact that you only get two spell slots now i know you get them back on a short rest but you know there are times where you might go for three entire sessions without getting a short rest in you know in the middle of in the middle of a dungeon crawl you don’t get a short rest you don’t get any kind of rest so i understand why people say it’s broken um because it is super powerful i mean i think it’s a great cantrip obviously.

Stephen:
[36:13] There are other counter it’s available you.

Barry:
[36:15] Know you’ve got to say that yeah and i have some of those i have some of those as well i like.

Mark:
[36:22] It to just swing in a sword right so yeah i never get spoiled by doing that and you’ve got your that’s your primary weapon.

Barry:
[36:28] Yeah i never get bored of shooting people in the face with my finger you’re.

Mark:
[36:32] Floating on an ocean in a small little boat and underneath you within the dnd universe and the and all of the systems and everything that’s gone before it it’s just there’s just an endless amount of options and they’re there and i think wizards of the coast potentially might want to have a look deeper into their catalogue of what they can bring out there because as i say that we’ve never in all our years have we have we come across a spell that breaks the system every i don’t know which i suppose comes closest but you complained about that in the fifth edition well.

Stephen:
[37:01] I didn’t play i thought it was fun it just changed the dynamic of the game somewhat because if you They can sort of wish themselves through that kind of part of the scenario as such, but then it can create other complications by doing so. But you’ve got to be on the board with it. You’ve got to be expecting it.

Barry:
[37:13] But again, I think that’s the sort of thing that comes down to having a good DM. Like if you’ve got something that’s really OP, I might introduce some consequences. You know, when you look at like the genie and the wishes thing as well, that’s something you have to be really, really careful with. You know, I wish you could make me a woman. And instead of being provided with a woman, you are turned into a woman. But, you know, Wish, I think, I don’t know anything about the spell, but certainly, like, philosophically, Wish can go fucking horrendously wrong.

Jon:
[37:40] I love that you said that was horrendously wrong, not… I’m good with it.

Barry:
[37:46] So not horrendously wrong, but not what you expected or wanted.

Mark:
[37:51] Barry would like to apologise to all transgender people.

Barry:
[37:57] Listen, I’m going to go out on a limb and say I’m the least likely person here. as given I have to apologise to a transgender person.

Jon:
[38:05] Apart from just now.

Mark:
[38:06] There’s a great example of how we just forget about real life and talk about the game, and that is exactly what this game is all about, forgetting about all of those hang-ups. So talking about wish and the consequences of badly wording your wish, that is a problem for DM, because you’re either giving them everything you want or you’re basically fucking them up.

Stephen:
[38:25] Yeah, yeah.

Mark:
[38:26] And also, look, we’re talking about a single spell amongst thousands of others, and we could carry on talking about this spell because that’s the brilliance of this system. There are so many spells like this and it’s the best magic system of all and I don’t think they play into that strength well enough, or publicize that as a selling point for the system. But I think it’s one of the best for me. The next one, we’re on 15, by the way, supports all play styles. Whether you love combat, exploration, or role-playing, the system adapts to suit your focus. So we did cover this in a previous podcast, just how versatile D&D is, when you’re thinking about what styles are going to play.

Stephen:
[39:06] It was my Desert Island game, wasn’t it? So, says it all.

Mark:
[39:09] Can I change my mind? I’m now going on record.

Stephen:
[39:12] It was just me and Barry.

Mark:
[39:13] You get the spinoff podcast yeah financed by wizards of the coast thank you in advance it’s like you’re like the george michael of no, I don’t know which way this is going at all you was cool where oh no no you’re like the harry styles of the rpg blokes oh.

Stephen:
[39:30] Okay yeah I’ll take that.

Mark:
[39:31] Okay right we’ll stop gushing about dnd or glazing as the young’uns call it john you don’t like that expression I.

Jon:
[39:41] Love that expression.

Mark:
[39:42] I have no idea what you’re talking about.

Jon:
[39:44] Exactly. Don’t use that word.

Stephen:
[39:47] Just Google it, children.

Jon:
[39:48] Don’t Google it, children.

Mark:
[39:50] That’s why we’re explicit, guys. Because of this person here.

Barry:
[39:54] He refs children, folks.

Stephen:
[39:56] He’s handing himself in.

Mark:
[39:57] He refs my children.

Jon:
[39:58] Yeah. And where did I first hear that phrase?

Mark:
[40:02] Yeah, but you do know what they meant by it and what you think.

Jon:
[40:05] Actually, I didn’t.

Mark:
[40:06] Oh. Is it too late to stop him DMing to our kids?

Stephen:
[40:09] Yes.

Mark:
[40:10] Six years too late, isn’t it? would.

Stephen:
[40:11] Have to erase their memories put through therapy.

Mark:
[40:14] Support long-term play the system is designed for campaigns spanning years creating deep player investments so i i think that dnd if i’m going to sit down and play a campaign like something 15 to 18 months dnd would be the system i i go to the.

Stephen:
[40:39] Come for you, John.

Jon:
[40:40] Yeah, they got you quick. They did. No, someone was listening.

Mark:
[40:46] Take them away. Yeah, I think it works brilliantly for campaign play. And not everybody wants to play games for 15 to 18 months. But if you do want to…

Jon:
[40:57] Hard timers.

Mark:
[40:58] Yeah. D&D is a brilliant system to do that with.

Barry:
[41:02] I think one of D&D’s strengths is in its versatility that I’ve played some epic D&D one-shots, I’ve played some epic six-session D&D games, and I’ve played a campaign that’s gone on for 18 months. You know, I do think it works at all three of those.

Mark:
[41:21] Yeah, just as well.

Barry:
[41:22] Yeah, just as well. Just as well. I’ve enjoyed short, medium, and long sessions playing D&D.

Jon:
[41:28] Part-time is. Two, three years. That gives you an excellent arc. you can explore the characters and and again yeah it’s not all about just the story as written you want to engage the players you want their characters dragging their arses through the mindscape of the world that you’re effing in and that’s what i’m after yeah personally i don’t like high power stuff i i get all the people that do and that’s great nah i’m.

Barry:
[42:00] I’m with you i’ve no i I don’t think I’ve ever had a campaign. Every campaign I’ve played, we’ve started at level one. I think I’m right in saying I don’t think I’ve gone any higher than level 12. I think if you’re playing something for three, four years, then I would expect to get up to really high levels. But for me, I feel like kind of a year to 18 months is the optimal amount of time for me to play a campaign.

Mark:
[42:22] Yeah, I think most of those modern campaigns now for D&D are set for that length of time.

Stephen:
[42:26] Yeah.

Jon:
[42:26] The level up as a reward or a target can change the dynamic of the game. Can advance the plot. It can completely sidestep it. You might get no XP because you’re just going off on a tangent or something. A bit like you right now.

Mark:
[42:42] I think.

Jon:
[42:43] Yeah, probably. It’s difficult to do a hard and fast guide on that.

Mark:
[42:50] Yeah, so 17, adaptable to any setting. While rooted in fantasy, it’s used to run games in any world. So D&D does have a number of different settings. Stephen, what’s your favourite D&D world?

Stephen:
[43:02] Probably Forgotten Realms, but closely followed by Dragonlance. Those two, yeah.

Mark:
[43:06] But your favourite genre is horror, so Ravenloft must be in there too.

Stephen:
[43:09] Yeah, that’s true. I forgot about Ravenloft. Ravenloft is a world in between, but yeah, I love Ravenloft, yeah. We’ll add those three then.

Mark:
[43:14] Okay, John, your favourite D&D worlds?

Jon:
[43:17] Well, probably the settings, Moonchase. But I’ve often fancied Spelljammer. I think that would be better for a one-shot for me. I just want to experience it. Dragonlance I really liked because it had the focus. It had the campaign. There was much more structure to it. Ravenloft, again, I love to read about it. You won’t get me back there.

Mark:
[43:43] For me, I liked, in the past, I liked Al-Qadim, which was… Oh, yeah.

Stephen:
[43:47] It’s never come back, has it?

Mark:
[43:48] Yeah. Yeah, the Arabian Nights type. Yeah, that’s not important.

Stephen:
[43:52] Yeah, what was that?

Mark:
[43:53] Dark Sun was survival horror, really, for D&D.

Stephen:
[43:56] It was Mad Max.

Jon:
[43:57] Horrorless, yeah.

Mark:
[43:58] Yeah, and I didn’t really go with that.

Jon:
[44:00] Planescape was a little bit… It didn’t have the world building, did it? It was…

Mark:
[44:03] Yeah.

Jon:
[44:03] They had examples and cities and odd bits.

Stephen:
[44:06] And you need a lot of water. Yeah.

Mark:
[44:09] Water was resource management with water. So I liked Alcadim, and I like Ravenloft and Dragonlance, too, and Forgotten Realms, too. And Barry, obviously your insight on this is not going to be so deep, but you’ve played Forgotten Realms mostly. Are there any of the other worlds that we’ve mentioned that you would potentially think, you know, that…

Barry:
[44:29] With the exception of Raven Lost, I didn’t know what any of them were.

Mark:
[44:33] Okay.

Barry:
[44:34] So no.

Mark:
[44:35] No, okay.

Barry:
[44:37] I mean, I suppose I’m looking forward to finding out. I mean, this is one of the things that I do like about it. Every time I sit down at a table with a different group of players in a slightly different setting and maybe a different world. It is different. It’s sufficiently different to be refreshing and start again. Do you know what I mean? It’s like there is enough material there for me to know that I’m, that, you know, the next one’s going to be just as good as the last one was.

Mark:
[44:59] Yeah. Okay. We’re to the last three. So iconic fantasy archetypes. It embraces classic fantasy tropes like elves, dwarves, and dragons while allowing unique interpretations. And I suppose this, we’re talking about ownership and IP. This is something that Wizards of the Coast cannot unpick from what they have. So it muddies the water a bit for them, doesn’t it? Because you can’t, like you suggested, Games Workshop have tried to copyright orcs. No, you can’t be doing that, right? A lot of what D&D offers to you cannot be copyrighted.

Stephen:
[45:32] Well, you say that. I mean, dragons, I didn’t think they could, but the red dragon. Who else has come up with red dragons, green dragons?

Jon:
[45:38] Well, they’re Teutonic, aren’t they? The basic design.

Stephen:
[45:42] Is theirs and it looks like a red dragon you see a red dragon somewhere else it doesn’t the dnd red dragon well very much like something to say well welsh dragon is completely different, but they don’t so yeah that’s different if you look at the red dragon on the wales the flag or whatever it is it doesn’t look like the dnd red dragon because it did they’d be having an issue but.

Mark:
[46:01] And also it’s wales so they probably didn’t count welsh people don’t have feelings.

Stephen:
[46:06] Oh well we holiday.

Mark:
[46:08] There last year and that’s what the impression i got.

Stephen:
[46:09] Is that we got you’re running with it are you no, um yeah so these iconic monsters.

Mark:
[46:21] They’re you know they’re wrapped in they’re part of the system and i think that’s the appeal so everybody who’s been brought up with these stories and would be introduced to.

Barry:
[46:28] I think yeah i think i mean this is the thing i think i said this earlier you will recognize stuff from pop culture from fantasy fiction from you know yeah there’s a lot there to draw on. And yeah, of course you can’t copyright the concept of an elf. You know, you can’t copyright the concept of a gnome.

Mark:
[46:47] Yeah, and I think they’re trying to introduce more of their own unique species into character choices. So the earlier editions of D&D, those would have just been the basic choices. But now, you’ve got the dragonborn, you’ve got the tieflings.

Barry:
[47:00] Yeah, yeah. There’s a lot of stuff in there.

Mark:
[47:01] Yeah, a lot of new ones that are their IP. It’s all rooted in fantasy archetypes and going back to Tolkien. It draws people in and it’ll give you a little head start on and what to expect if you’ve watched Lord of the Rings or just remember Greek mythology, then these things have large influences within this setting and they don’t shy away from it. They’re not trying to reinvent the wheel on a basic level. And I think that makes it far more endearing to new players.

Jon:
[47:29] If you set a campaign or even a scenario in a setting, you want to keep it fairly faithful. So if you’re setting one in the Greek pantheon, Again, you’re looking at race limitations, you’ve got particular types of monsters, do a bit of research, but don’t have, you know, an orc would have no place there.

Mark:
[47:52] So the last two we have here, legendary adventures, published modules like the ones we’ve discussed already, Curse of Strahd, Out of the Abyss, and more. You know, these are masterpieces of storytelling.

Stephen:
[48:06] Just to say, we spoke about Stranger Things, didn’t we? We had Vecna.

Mark:
[48:09] It

Stephen:
[48:10] Was like in a story arc in first edition dnd i think and it’s kind of these characters greyhawk yes definitely and these are season characters that have been in scenarios in dnd that have made mainstream media so what can you say about legendary scenarios there.

Mark:
[48:22] Yeah and and they’ve been great in the past but i’m of the belief and i believe because we’ve spoken privately about this steven that this current edition of dnd the campaigns and the adventures are really the best that we’ve found has ever been written for yeah because they kind.

Stephen:
[48:37] Of give you the information you need as a dm as well a lot of the previous editions did kind of leave you hanging a bit but these have gone back to good writing and.

Mark:
[48:44] You know well.

Stephen:
[48:45] Detailed and gives you what you need to run the game yeah.

Mark:
[48:48] So yeah for barry you may not know um in the past that the games that were created far relied far more upon the dm to kind of come up with a lot of the plot hooks that they used to sometimes just they’re almost present in the sandbox they were in second edition these modules you’ve been playing in from our experience from all of our play you’ve this this is probably the best it has ever been as far as the the quality of story writing the the the campaign and how they’ve been put together and the ones that you’ve played in particular you know you’ve.

Barry:
[49:19] Complete from what i you know from a from a player’s experience so you know i know that dm’s put a lot of working but sometimes you know when when it’s going really well when it’s really well well written you know scenario sometimes the dm can make it look effortless and i think that is about the quality of the material that.

Mark:
[49:36] The dm.

Barry:
[49:36] Has got if they’re not having to wing it um then yeah obviously i think it’s going to be a better experience generally speaking for players.

Mark:
[49:44] From a dming point of view it’s just once so wonderful to have such a well-written, campaign to to rely upon does.

Stephen:
[49:50] Make it easier yeah.

Mark:
[49:51] Yeah yeah yeah well why would you want a sandbox that you know sometimes you just think it’s that good just run with it and then there’s a good basis to then make stuff.

Stephen:
[50:00] Up if you want to.

Mark:
[50:01] So in our community i when we uh have new dms come through i’m always they know this because i tell them i’m always hoping they say you know i’m going to run with curse of strad or beyond the witch light or i’m going to this is what i want to do and i want to run it by the book and i’m going to you know we’re going to play it in a traditional sense and i think brilliant because if you do that you’re going to have unlimited players you’re just going to get anybody that comes through the door confidently put them with you and they’re going to stick, they’re going to enjoy it. And that’s power to the scenario. I always feel confident then, no matter how experienced I are as a DM, it’s going to work out for them. These scenarios give me confidence that the people that run in them, myself included, are going to be able to provide a good experience for the people planning. And so the last thing here is community support.

Jon:
[50:50] Yeah. People advertise online. Local papers will have your youth clubs and community centres, always worth a look. Have a word with the person on the desk because you might not be the first person that’s asked if they’ve got a group. and they can put you in direction rather. You could start your own. Mark did.

Mark:
[51:12] Well, not just me. I say the four of us, there’s one guy missing from the OGs as far as our own community is concerned. But we all, yeah, we built that from scratch. In future podcasts, I want to detail how that was achieved and how you could go about doing that yourself. Something that anybody could do. So, yeah, we’ll save that for the future.

Stephen:
[51:31] Obviously, with the D&W specifically, it’s all about Dungeons & Dragons. They had, obviously, the new edition has come out. that was play tested by the community so if he was involved in the dungeon dragon community you could have play tested the um the 2024 edition wizard the coast have our websites for you can get um alternative rules as well yeah.

Mark:
[51:46] And some really good podcasts apparently.

Barry:
[51:48] The community resources is something that that really appeals to me and when i’m thinking of playing a class that i’ve never played before i will find threads on you know various social medias and stuff like a lot of people talking about how they built their character and what the pros and cons were of playing it that way i also really love reading up on house rules that people have come up with some of them are really imaginative and i’m like i would love to i would love to play that yeah in terms of the kind of community resources for me it is about players talking to players, I think that’s a really important part of that community. And it’s like, I don’t, I wouldn’t just rip someone’s build, but it does give me ideas on like, oh, okay, that’s quite interesting. If you take that and that, it has this effect. And it’s kind of stuff that I don’t think you’d necessarily get from just reading it. I think having someone’s perspective on it is really important.

Mark:
[52:38] And if you do the search, then there’s always something there. Somebody has an opinion of.

Barry:
[52:43] Oh, absolutely.

Stephen:
[52:43] It might be a good time to say that we have a Discord channel. Yes, we have a community.

Mark:
[52:48] It’s um it it’s just called rpg blokes there’ll be an invite link at the end of this podcast or within the description we’re looking to to people just to come in and and talk about the kind of things that we’ve been talking about maybe get some advice on the game not just from us but from from you guys anybody else that wants to input we’ll discuss what we can with you and yeah good time to advertise it so to finish this one off actually i’m just going to ask each of you uh because we’ve talked about 20 different things and we’ve probably added a few of our own along the way. What is your favourite thing about Dungeons & Dragons? Who wants to go first?

Barry:
[53:20] My favourite thing about Dungeons & Dragons are the dice.

Mark:
[53:23] Yeah, but the dice exist in every system, I suppose.

Barry:
[53:26] They’re not the same in every system, though, are they?

Mark:
[53:28] Yeah.

Barry:
[53:28] I mean, pool systems use D6s or D6s, they’re not the same.

Mark:
[53:33] Oh, you like the full selection?

Barry:
[53:34] Yeah, I like having every single solitary, yeah, seven different okay, let me rephrase that, is having seven different shaped dice.

Jon:
[53:42] Earthstorm will blow your mind.

Barry:
[53:45] Oh, okay.

Mark:
[53:45] Or John’s dice bag would blow your mind.

Barry:
[53:48] John’s dice bag will put my back out.

Jon:
[53:51] When it’s done right, which most of the time it is, just the world building, the fluff, the system, that can come and go. The world building stays. The characters, the backdrops, if you can imagine yourself in it, then that means it’s A, written well and B, you want to replay. That’s all reffing.

Mark:
[54:17] Okay, Stephen, do you have your favourite element?

Stephen:
[54:19] Well, I’ll be very specific. I do love the magic items of Dungeons & Dragons. It is unique. I think it’s any really other game that has that plethora of magic items that can make you feel special and warm inside when you’ve picked up your full weapon. Lovely. Perfect.

Mark:
[54:36] I do love the magic system, magic items too, but my favourite I think is the scenarios, the campaigns. That’s what I’m going to be left with. I think there’s just the love of those particular games. We’ve done well there. We’ve sold D&D to the world. Just what they need.

Jon:
[54:53] Not sponsored.

Mark:
[54:54] No, we’ve done that for free, guys. Remember that. So that’s the end of another RPG Blokes podcast. And we’re getting boring, isn’t it? I keep saying, go for it, Stephen. How do you want to do this?

Barry:
[55:05] Stephen, crack on.

Stephen:
[55:06] So let’s Slice and Dice Slice and Dice.